Kaiaka Bay Beach Park and Kaiaka State Recreation Area are located in the ahapua'a of Pa'ala'a on the North Shore of Oahu. It is on these grounds that once stood an ancient heiau complex. Kapuakapuakea Heiau was such a significant heiau that we know through books, chants, and mo'olelo that it is the site where at least one Mo'i was annointed, and one of the places where the caul of the Ali'i were taken. Kapukapuakea's history extends back into the ancient past to a time when Polynesians were masterfully voyaging across the largest ocean in the world. The ceremonial, spiritual, and navigational history of our people is embedded on this landscape which serves to remind us of our genealogy and our connections to our Polynesian brethren.
Now, it is these sacred grounds that are the proposed site for the construction of a dog park.
The North Shore Woof Pack, as they call themselves, pushed this through the neighborhood board meeting and it was approved "in concept" by the board without any consultation of the Kanaka Maoli community. Malama Keia 'Aina 'O Haleiwa was formed to tell this pack A'OLE! Kaiaka is a sacred place and a dog park here is more than inappropriate it is insulting! Find another place! Our spirituality, our culture, our wahi kapu are more important than your dogs!
The North Shore Board is meeting again on Tuesday, October 27, at Ali'i Beach Park's John Kalili Surf Center. We are calling for a press conference at 6:30 and are asking all who read this to show support by coming to the meeting wearing red shirts.
Mahalo nui loa,
E ola ka la hui!
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It's so amazing that I am thinking of those times breathing in the ocean air at Punaluu and Hauula park. Everynow and then I go to our family graves and rake leaves and I remember how your mom and dad and how they held the rake and I do the same. Dad said that he rakes the opala (people opala) to clean the way of the natural opala, in other words he wanted me to see the difference. I had a difficult time distinguishing the difference between people and nature. So much was going on in the 70s. At this particular place where our family graves exist--Liliu would visit and bath there.
As for your brother, Ed was doing his thing and I remember your brother being with him at that time.
I want you to know that I can still see mom's beauty, her face, eyes and bare foot on the land. I have those sensations too, I walk barefoot sometimes and have these amazing feelings of touching the earth. Today, I see our children doing the same in our parks and I know they will always be the children of our aina.
Dad also talked about the double edge sword, at that time it sounded odd for me because I was innocent as to what I was doing or getting into for he loved my grandmother and grandfather. So, I got to hear their voices through your dad on any one of my visits. Thank you for sharing your parents with me, my memories of them are an amazing gift. Kaohi
Your dad knew my grandmother so which is how come and why I would sit and talk with him. We talked about my participation with PKO and the about to be formed OHA. Your dad had a lot to say about culture and politics and because so much was happening in the 70s--it was politics of the day. When you dad was sitting on the table at Hauula with a bowl, I knew I could stop and eat limu. As I am eating he would tell me things about my grandmother, he loved her very much. My grandmother was a minister. John Kahana Sr. and Jr. would stop by sometimes too. Mr. Hiram in his last days would go to the park and lay down on the grass. Raymond Kalili was my pal, I do miss him from time to time when ever I had a question he would try to teach me about the shore line and migration, winds and things. As for Kaapu, his son would walk around UH picking sandlewood seeds and we would have a converstation about his next action as a politician, he was into shintake mushrooms. I had a pretty neat life with the different old timers from Hauula. When ever I can I try to have a conversation with Mr. Logan. Are you still living in the area?
The fast pace life I run is because the movement has been in my life for almost 35 years. One can't just be a 24/7 activist, there is work, family and lots of literary works. There are days I can't keep up with myself. We just got through with too much UH forums, which were the greatest I have seen so far. So I'm still digesting these brilliant works of research from different scholars.
Is that your brother with Ed Kaiwi in the states? Kaohi
I moved to Moku Keawe about the time you visited my dad & have revisited on occasion...my parents & older brother's live in the realm of the spirit world now...only my baby brother & oldest sister's live on O'ahu...haven't been back there since my mom died last year.
In regards to your inquiry...sad to say, I only have one brother that's alive now...but I do recall that my brother Alan stayed with a Kaiwi in Anahola during the hurricane "Iniki" assistance...he went there to help the ohana while working with Hawaii Dredging...to rebuild their homes...are you referring to him? S. Kanaka'ole
I lived in Hauula for 14 years and I had an opportunity to have talk stories with the greats. One being Mr. Kanakaole at Punnaluu and Hauula park. Also too, my stopping to Punaluu to 'talk story' on the movement with Mr. Kanakaole and Mr. Kaapu. I wished I was a lot more attentive to Mr. Kaapu, but I was still new to the movement and sadly, I was uncomfortable with his wearing of a malo. I regret my ignorance because he knew politics, practice ancient religion, and he knew the old ways. Regret, regret....
I have in my hand "Unwritten Literature of Hawaii" by Nathaniel B. Emerson, 1909 Wahsington Government Printing Office. It's the first printing edition and I'm not fond of missionaries none what so ever. I too have wondered about that whole Haleiwa, Liliu and Kaahumanu's visit to Kauai. She brought back to Oahu the women from Kauai to weave tapestry and that discipline turned into quilting along side the Windward coast. I believe Kaahumanu (can you enlighten me) left these skillful weavers at Waialua.
Mahalo nui loa...I am deeply honored that you acknowledge my father & kako as being among the great teachers/historians of their time...we all have our regrets...the should've...could've...would've...let that not hinder you from your path...imua...eveything happens for a reason...the gift of knowledge...good & bad allows us to understand what needs to be done...our heart tells us to do the right thing...remember...wisdom is within the eyes of the beholder... slow down & pay attention...listen to what your na'au instinctively knows...all good things come to those who are patient... when we are ready for the wisdom of the Ancient Ones...the teacher shall appear...ho'o mau kau kau...be ready to receive...go with the flow, rather than fight it...a ho!
Let not the ego prevent us from working together...hana lau lima...ho'ala kanawai...let not the sins of the past prevent us any further...let go & be free...keiki o ka aina...no more regrets!
p.s.
Look at the big picture...only then shall the pieces fit accordingly...S. Kanaka'ole
Maika'i for the posting...so disheartening to hear. I never heard of our royals or locals having dog parks. You just took care of them on your own property. If one can't do without a dog park that then they shouldn't have pets. Don't impose on us islanders that's the big city people talk because of concrete living. We don't want concrete living and what it also brings to us in changes to our landscape of 'aina. Good luck on your meeting.
My name is Simbralynn Leiolani Kanaka'ole. I remember going with my father to many places that were dear to him, including Kaiaka...but my favorite of them all was uncle David Kaapu's hale at Punalu'u...I remember the grass huts surrounded by fishponds...his lauhala hat & red malu...the scent of his cigar still lingers in my memories. He tried desperately to be faithful to the old ways & said, with more sorrow than bitterness, that he had been destroyed even before he was born...at the time I did not understand exactly what he meant...let us examine what he meant?
At age 5 I begged my father to teach me the Hawaiian language so that I could understand what they talked about & was told it was forbidden...I did not understand..."Why?", I asked...He said that it was the law & that if caught...they would be jailed...I was dumbfounded...Why would the government put my ohana in jail for speaking our language? Seeing my confusion he tried to explain that what was said or done among our ohana could not be discussed in public...that the government created the schools to teach us & that I must learn the ways of my mother's family because his was not clean...ka pulu...how could this be true...was this what kako meant?
We learned by example...we were taught the ways of the old ones, without the Hawaiian language...we lived our lives caring for the land & sea...we understood the importance of malama o ka aina o ke kai...this is their legacy & the legacy I give my keiki.
Early Hawaiians were often characterized as gentle, gracious, generous & polite...chiefs & commoners alike were taught the traditional values of humility, kindness & generosity...kupuna taught keiki of all social strata...good breeding was demonstrated by acting & speaking with courtesy & sitting with dignity.
Courtesies expected of ali'i & commoners alike, were strictly enforced...punishment was severe & immediate...one can appreciate why such great care was taken in teaching & learning appropriate behavior. By the mid 1800's these traditionally taught courtesies & behaviors were being replaced & lost by foreign humanism ...Is this what kako meant?
The 21st century has brought more challenges & changes to the Hawaiian family system, many of which are not desirable. It is clear, at least from the archaeological/scientific perspective, that Kaiaka is a significant area...It is very clear that Kaiaka is a very significant area to North Shore Woof Pack for purposes of a "dog park"...but of what significance is Kaiaka to Na kanaka o keiki o ka aina o Hawaii nei...more importantly, does it really matter?
Exploring the significance from three sets of eyes...the scientists' in search of knowledge; the Woof pack who wish to make a dog park upon our historical sites; and, the Na Kanaka' search for meaning...we live on, in, & with the land...the land is our bank...into which is invested the spirits of our ancestors, our gods & goddesses, our tears, our fears & hopes...it is the land itself that is sacred. Like modern churches...the stonewalls that forms the heiau were used to define our imagination...a way of marking a sacred spot...of providing a place for the gods & goddesses...but it is the land that is the temple. To create a dog park at Kaiaka is a defilement of the temple.
Archaeological evidence indicates that the valley of the Anahulu river's mouth was the site of ancient Hawaiian villages...the river valley was abandoned & repopulated in the early 19th century by Kamehameha I to grow food to support his military expeditions...In 1832, Chief Laanui & US Protestant missionaries (John & Ursula Sophia Emerson) established the Liliuokalani Church...in the later 19th century the village of Haleiwa (house of the frigate bird) & surrounding river valley became a popular summer vacation destination for the Hawaiian monarchs...In 1894, the Constitution of the Republic of Hawaii expropriated Crown lands without compensation...Queen Liliuokalani brought suit against the United States for compensation but this claim was denied [Liliuokalani vs United States, 45 Ct. Cls. 418 (1910)] Kamehameha III had separated his private lands from those of the government to safeguard them from Western takeover. Is this what kako meant?
With the deterioration of our culture & resources, Na Kanaka are faced with nothing less than extinction...what of an entire species of people? Are we not important? Is our battle futile? How can a handful of people fight the powers' that be (State of Hawaii et al) who use public welfare & safety to defend its' criminal actions? In this attitude of despair that we battle, against all odds to regain...piece by piece...all that has been lost or stolen...we are charged with the responsibility of educating...keeping communications & our thoughts flowing...Kaulana Na Pua...remember ohana what our kupuna visualized, practiced & taught us...Ua Mau Ke Ea O Ka Aina I Ka Pono...ma'a to the culture...pa'a to the aina...together we stand...oni pa'a...Na Kanaka...the world knows who we are!
Mahalo...keep up the good work...prayers & blessings to you...S Kanaka'ole
Aloha e Kawika;
Please correct me if I am wrong, is Kapukapuakea on the penisula by a school, I forget the name of the school. My husband and I used to hike a lot on Oahu. I remember going out to this penisula and got scared away by chicken fights. But the connection is significant with Taputapuatea in Tahiti. The heiau in Tahiti is on a penisula similar to Kapukapuakea. And you are correct about our wahi pana. I live on the big island now, came home to my mo'okuauhau. I live on the slopes of Mauna Kea, one more big fight here. Keep up the good work take care and God bless luv
Sharon
I think you mean sugar barons...Sugar planters were mainly immigrants. The royals allowed this as an industry. At the same time they were deceived - for the underlying truth was that the real property titles were to be clouded in the end. What we know today as being "stolen or taken away".
I find it unusual that your grandma was hidden in a cave - for what purpose? Didn't she have protectors like most ali'i? For even if you went underground like our family did, we never hid physically for the people protected our identity as loyal to our family - it's been like this here on the Big Island and has never changed. For even at that time they carried our name in politics....meaning "during the plantation years"
My eyebrows are being raised when you say things like this as if it was a mystery. Here on the Big Island, nothing is a mystery except where certain special places are which carry significant weight but never shared with anyone - it goes to your grave because that is how it is protected - in perpetuity. Hawaii may be the Biggest Island of the chain but word travels far sometimes before it even gets to the people whom are affected so your story of your grandma I find unusual and why I say this at this time.
Excuse me members of Maoliworld, I just have to say this to A.G. because sometimes "stuff" just doesn't add up. When someone wants to claim an elite list of genealogy and would like to push this for use as authentic, I question it because there are things that have been said here by A.G. concerning genealogy that raises my eyebrow in relation to basic /general genealogy of royals or chieftain lines. This is the beauty of agreeing to disagree to find perspective because it always brings with it truth to the matter.
Yes I get pretty perturbed as she does but I guess you can say that's the passion we have individually which some have seen here on Maoliworld.
In regards to A.G.'s postings below...I still question - why was your grandmother put in a cave during that time period? Maybe I should ask your relative Keali'i if you can't answer that huh? If you can't answer this question, then don't drop tidbits of information as if it's a mystery. Better to not share at all than to try and bait po'e with your unusual storytelling. I just tell it like it is, cause the time period you bring about with caves is like I said, "UNUSUAL". If anything, here on the Big Island during that time period you bring up in your story, most were given hard liquor to disable their mind to get deeds to be signed over - but beaten? Never heard of such a thing at least here on the Big Island which you mention your grandmother was hidden in a cave here on the Big Island because why? And what plantation here on the Big Island - there were not many sugar plantations now so....Hmmmm....this is why I question, especially after posting information about Hale of Keawe. Naihe was in charge the caves down in Kona for ali'i; my family also has been caretakers of many things regarding things sacred and being kept in perpetuity - no sugar plantations there in Kona - so what are you inferring in your story about your grandmother?
No disrespect to your grandmother, I am only questioning history you are portraying during this time period you mention Davis/Young and this is part of Kohala too on the South side. I pass the extended family gravesite area in South Kohala all the time on my way down to Kona. And Papa Akau and their 'ohana has many stories about the south side of Kohala of which I can recall no stories of a 5 yr old girl hidden in caves on that end of Kohala. The rest of the Gold Coast of Kohala are stories in connection to specific sites along the ali'i trail. The hotels on that side that have sealed up some caves we all are familiar with the stories.
So maybe you can share this special story for authenticity in detail - I'd sure like to hear it...Hmmmm.
Rest assured if I don't hear your answer I won't push it - I'll take it as it is. Just know that I'm the kind of hawaiian from Kohala that will say, "Who said?" In today's generation that will equate to: "Waht? Come again?" HELL-ERR!
Replies
As for your brother, Ed was doing his thing and I remember your brother being with him at that time.
I want you to know that I can still see mom's beauty, her face, eyes and bare foot on the land. I have those sensations too, I walk barefoot sometimes and have these amazing feelings of touching the earth. Today, I see our children doing the same in our parks and I know they will always be the children of our aina.
Dad also talked about the double edge sword, at that time it sounded odd for me because I was innocent as to what I was doing or getting into for he loved my grandmother and grandfather. So, I got to hear their voices through your dad on any one of my visits. Thank you for sharing your parents with me, my memories of them are an amazing gift. Kaohi
Your dad knew my grandmother so which is how come and why I would sit and talk with him. We talked about my participation with PKO and the about to be formed OHA. Your dad had a lot to say about culture and politics and because so much was happening in the 70s--it was politics of the day. When you dad was sitting on the table at Hauula with a bowl, I knew I could stop and eat limu. As I am eating he would tell me things about my grandmother, he loved her very much. My grandmother was a minister. John Kahana Sr. and Jr. would stop by sometimes too. Mr. Hiram in his last days would go to the park and lay down on the grass. Raymond Kalili was my pal, I do miss him from time to time when ever I had a question he would try to teach me about the shore line and migration, winds and things. As for Kaapu, his son would walk around UH picking sandlewood seeds and we would have a converstation about his next action as a politician, he was into shintake mushrooms. I had a pretty neat life with the different old timers from Hauula. When ever I can I try to have a conversation with Mr. Logan. Are you still living in the area?
The fast pace life I run is because the movement has been in my life for almost 35 years. One can't just be a 24/7 activist, there is work, family and lots of literary works. There are days I can't keep up with myself. We just got through with too much UH forums, which were the greatest I have seen so far. So I'm still digesting these brilliant works of research from different scholars.
Is that your brother with Ed Kaiwi in the states? Kaohi
I moved to Moku Keawe about the time you visited my dad & have revisited on occasion...my parents & older brother's live in the realm of the spirit world now...only my baby brother & oldest sister's live on O'ahu...haven't been back there since my mom died last year.
In regards to your inquiry...sad to say, I only have one brother that's alive now...but I do recall that my brother Alan stayed with a Kaiwi in Anahola during the hurricane "Iniki" assistance...he went there to help the ohana while working with Hawaii Dredging...to rebuild their homes...are you referring to him? S. Kanaka'ole
I lived in Hauula for 14 years and I had an opportunity to have talk stories with the greats. One being Mr. Kanakaole at Punnaluu and Hauula park. Also too, my stopping to Punaluu to 'talk story' on the movement with Mr. Kanakaole and Mr. Kaapu. I wished I was a lot more attentive to Mr. Kaapu, but I was still new to the movement and sadly, I was uncomfortable with his wearing of a malo. I regret my ignorance because he knew politics, practice ancient religion, and he knew the old ways. Regret, regret....
I have in my hand "Unwritten Literature of Hawaii" by Nathaniel B. Emerson, 1909 Wahsington Government Printing Office. It's the first printing edition and I'm not fond of missionaries none what so ever. I too have wondered about that whole Haleiwa, Liliu and Kaahumanu's visit to Kauai. She brought back to Oahu the women from Kauai to weave tapestry and that discipline turned into quilting along side the Windward coast. I believe Kaahumanu (can you enlighten me) left these skillful weavers at Waialua.
Always look forward to your sharing. Kaohi
Mahalo nui loa...I am deeply honored that you acknowledge my father & kako as being among the great teachers/historians of their time...we all have our regrets...the should've...could've...would've...let that not hinder you from your path...imua...eveything happens for a reason...the gift of knowledge...good & bad allows us to understand what needs to be done...our heart tells us to do the right thing...remember...wisdom is within the eyes of the beholder... slow down & pay attention...listen to what your na'au instinctively knows...all good things come to those who are patient... when we are ready for the wisdom of the Ancient Ones...the teacher shall appear...ho'o mau kau kau...be ready to receive...go with the flow, rather than fight it...a ho!
Let not the ego prevent us from working together...hana lau lima...ho'ala kanawai...let not the sins of the past prevent us any further...let go & be free...keiki o ka aina...no more regrets!
p.s.
Look at the big picture...only then shall the pieces fit accordingly...S. Kanaka'ole
My name is Simbralynn Leiolani Kanaka'ole. I remember going with my father to many places that were dear to him, including Kaiaka...but my favorite of them all was uncle David Kaapu's hale at Punalu'u...I remember the grass huts surrounded by fishponds...his lauhala hat & red malu...the scent of his cigar still lingers in my memories. He tried desperately to be faithful to the old ways & said, with more sorrow than bitterness, that he had been destroyed even before he was born...at the time I did not understand exactly what he meant...let us examine what he meant?
At age 5 I begged my father to teach me the Hawaiian language so that I could understand what they talked about & was told it was forbidden...I did not understand..."Why?", I asked...He said that it was the law & that if caught...they would be jailed...I was dumbfounded...Why would the government put my ohana in jail for speaking our language? Seeing my confusion he tried to explain that what was said or done among our ohana could not be discussed in public...that the government created the schools to teach us & that I must learn the ways of my mother's family because his was not clean...ka pulu...how could this be true...was this what kako meant?
We learned by example...we were taught the ways of the old ones, without the Hawaiian language...we lived our lives caring for the land & sea...we understood the importance of malama o ka aina o ke kai...this is their legacy & the legacy I give my keiki.
Early Hawaiians were often characterized as gentle, gracious, generous & polite...chiefs & commoners alike were taught the traditional values of humility, kindness & generosity...kupuna taught keiki of all social strata...good breeding was demonstrated by acting & speaking with courtesy & sitting with dignity.
Courtesies expected of ali'i & commoners alike, were strictly enforced...punishment was severe & immediate...one can appreciate why such great care was taken in teaching & learning appropriate behavior. By the mid 1800's these traditionally taught courtesies & behaviors were being replaced & lost by foreign humanism ...Is this what kako meant?
The 21st century has brought more challenges & changes to the Hawaiian family system, many of which are not desirable. It is clear, at least from the archaeological/scientific perspective, that Kaiaka is a significant area...It is very clear that Kaiaka is a very significant area to North Shore Woof Pack for purposes of a "dog park"...but of what significance is Kaiaka to Na kanaka o keiki o ka aina o Hawaii nei...more importantly, does it really matter?
Exploring the significance from three sets of eyes...the scientists' in search of knowledge; the Woof pack who wish to make a dog park upon our historical sites; and, the Na Kanaka' search for meaning...we live on, in, & with the land...the land is our bank...into which is invested the spirits of our ancestors, our gods & goddesses, our tears, our fears & hopes...it is the land itself that is sacred. Like modern churches...the stonewalls that forms the heiau were used to define our imagination...a way of marking a sacred spot...of providing a place for the gods & goddesses...but it is the land that is the temple. To create a dog park at Kaiaka is a defilement of the temple.
Archaeological evidence indicates that the valley of the Anahulu river's mouth was the site of ancient Hawaiian villages...the river valley was abandoned & repopulated in the early 19th century by Kamehameha I to grow food to support his military expeditions...In 1832, Chief Laanui & US Protestant missionaries (John & Ursula Sophia Emerson) established the Liliuokalani Church...in the later 19th century the village of Haleiwa (house of the frigate bird) & surrounding river valley became a popular summer vacation destination for the Hawaiian monarchs...In 1894, the Constitution of the Republic of Hawaii expropriated Crown lands without compensation...Queen Liliuokalani brought suit against the United States for compensation but this claim was denied [Liliuokalani vs United States, 45 Ct. Cls. 418 (1910)] Kamehameha III had separated his private lands from those of the government to safeguard them from Western takeover. Is this what kako meant?
With the deterioration of our culture & resources, Na Kanaka are faced with nothing less than extinction...what of an entire species of people? Are we not important? Is our battle futile? How can a handful of people fight the powers' that be (State of Hawaii et al) who use public welfare & safety to defend its' criminal actions? In this attitude of despair that we battle, against all odds to regain...piece by piece...all that has been lost or stolen...we are charged with the responsibility of educating...keeping communications & our thoughts flowing...Kaulana Na Pua...remember ohana what our kupuna visualized, practiced & taught us...Ua Mau Ke Ea O Ka Aina I Ka Pono...ma'a to the culture...pa'a to the aina...together we stand...oni pa'a...Na Kanaka...the world knows who we are!
Mahalo...keep up the good work...prayers & blessings to you...S Kanaka'ole
Please correct me if I am wrong, is Kapukapuakea on the penisula by a school, I forget the name of the school. My husband and I used to hike a lot on Oahu. I remember going out to this penisula and got scared away by chicken fights. But the connection is significant with Taputapuatea in Tahiti. The heiau in Tahiti is on a penisula similar to Kapukapuakea. And you are correct about our wahi pana. I live on the big island now, came home to my mo'okuauhau. I live on the slopes of Mauna Kea, one more big fight here. Keep up the good work take care and God bless luv
Sharon
I find it unusual that your grandma was hidden in a cave - for what purpose? Didn't she have protectors like most ali'i? For even if you went underground like our family did, we never hid physically for the people protected our identity as loyal to our family - it's been like this here on the Big Island and has never changed. For even at that time they carried our name in politics....meaning "during the plantation years"
My eyebrows are being raised when you say things like this as if it was a mystery. Here on the Big Island, nothing is a mystery except where certain special places are which carry significant weight but never shared with anyone - it goes to your grave because that is how it is protected - in perpetuity. Hawaii may be the Biggest Island of the chain but word travels far sometimes before it even gets to the people whom are affected so your story of your grandma I find unusual and why I say this at this time.
Excuse me members of Maoliworld, I just have to say this to A.G. because sometimes "stuff" just doesn't add up. When someone wants to claim an elite list of genealogy and would like to push this for use as authentic, I question it because there are things that have been said here by A.G. concerning genealogy that raises my eyebrow in relation to basic /general genealogy of royals or chieftain lines. This is the beauty of agreeing to disagree to find perspective because it always brings with it truth to the matter.
Yes I get pretty perturbed as she does but I guess you can say that's the passion we have individually which some have seen here on Maoliworld.
No disrespect to your grandmother, I am only questioning history you are portraying during this time period you mention Davis/Young and this is part of Kohala too on the South side. I pass the extended family gravesite area in South Kohala all the time on my way down to Kona. And Papa Akau and their 'ohana has many stories about the south side of Kohala of which I can recall no stories of a 5 yr old girl hidden in caves on that end of Kohala. The rest of the Gold Coast of Kohala are stories in connection to specific sites along the ali'i trail. The hotels on that side that have sealed up some caves we all are familiar with the stories.
So maybe you can share this special story for authenticity in detail - I'd sure like to hear it...Hmmmm.
Rest assured if I don't hear your answer I won't push it - I'll take it as it is. Just know that I'm the kind of hawaiian from Kohala that will say, "Who said?" In today's generation that will equate to: "Waht? Come again?" HELL-ERR!
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